Fear and Loathing in Montreal
For somebody growing up outside of Montreal I was of the belief that I was missing out because I lacked access to a media that covered the Canadiens. When Montreal Canadiens communities sprung up all over the web and the Gazette entered my radar I thought all my problems were solved.
Life was simple. Leaf fans were stupid, Hab fans were smart and I could finally interact with my proper herd. Unfortunately access only opened me up to the reality that we are all the same irrational emotional beings. Dumb Leaf fans were not dumb because they were Leaf fans, they were dumb because they were dumb. I found the equivalent to every columnist and type of Leaf fan wearing Bleu, Blanc et Rouge through my new access.
The only difference that I noticed between the two franchises was totally based on environment. One fanbase was spoiled, one was longing to be spoiled. At one point in time a Canadiens fan was justified to be arrogant, entitled and dismissive of Leaf fans and Leaf fans were justified in being envious, jealous and resentful. Those days are no longer valid, yet they still exist because of environment.
This environment of expectation continues to poison todays coverage of the Canadiens. As of right now the Canadiens are 3 points behind the Leafs, one city is going crazy with blame, fear and prophecies of disaster, the other fanbase is puffing out their chest and printing off Kessel for MVP t-shirts.
All of this is emotional irrational behaviour and analysis.
The one thing that I feel seperates EOTP from the majority of communities is the level headed, rational and researched opinions that set the stage for allowing the real time narrative to set itself. There is a nice balance of math and game analysis to avoid major meltdowns
Results and Process need to be seperated. When they aren't and you sprinkle in emotional distress you get panic.
I am tired of hearing what Montreal's record needs to be in order to make the playoffs. Fans view the season as linear with a definitive beginning and ending, but the season needs to be viewed as 82 different events worth 2 points.
It seems sensible to write something like this if you view it in this manner.
The Canadiens’ 25 points represent 48.1 per cent of what they could have garnered through 26 games of the schedule. To reach 96 points, they will have to rack up 63.4 per cent of what’s available the rest of the way.
This statement represents that it is unreasonable to expect a team that is barely .500 to be able to play .634 hockey the rest of the way, but that thinking defines what the Canadiens are after 25 games and then sets that expectation on what seems like an unreasonable goal. This is result based analysis and not process based.
We can do this all season to varying degrees. If we did that with the Bruins only 33 days ago we would be presented with this....
The Bruins have played at a .300 rate, in order to finish with 96 points they will have to play .642 hockey in order to qualify for the playoffs. To put this in the proper perspective, the Bruins only played .628 hockey when they won the Stanley Cup. Tall order right?
Let's re-write that statement 33 days later.
The Bruins have played at a .688 rate, in order to finish with 96 points they will have to play .543 hockey in order to qualify for the playoffs.
Who are the Bruins? Are they defined by 10 games or 25 games? This sample size is way to small to make these type of definitive statements.
The original statement places the Canadiens on an island and ignores the fact that the teams in their vicinity have to also play at a similar rate to amass 96 points.
| Teams | Record Today | Qualify with 96 points | Wins required |
| Toronto | .576 | .589 | 33 |
| Buffalo | .557 | .598 | 33.5 |
| Washington | .540 | .605 | 34.5 |
| Ottawa | .519 | .616 | 34.5 |
| MONTREAL | .500 | .627 | 34.5 |
| New Jersey | .500 | .623 | 35.5 |
| WInnipeg | .500 | .625 | 35 |
| Tampa Bay | .480 | .632 | 36 |
Let us assume that with 55 games remaining that the 3-4 points the Panthers, Bruins, Rangers, Penguins and Flyers own on the Canadiens are unassailable. In order for the Canadiens to accomplish the impossible dream they need to win ONE more game than Washington, Ottawa, NJ, Winnipeg and Tampa to gain 8th place. If we dream even higher it would only require TWO full wins more than the mighty Maple Leafs?
Now which statement exists in the world of negativity and hyperbole and which is centered in the narrative of reality? Why paint a narrative of doom and gloom when we can look at the rest of the field and assess the situation with perspective?
Why is it necessary to define playoff success and probability with 55 games left?
Today the Canadiens are viewed as a 46% chance to make the playoffs at sportsclubstats. I believe that it is a strong probability tool, but not with a 25 game sample size. It bases it's strength of schedule based on limited data, at this point in time the program will project a March game against the Wild as a likely loss because of their quick start and a game against the Canucks with a more probable victory.
How did the limited data set perform last season? Let's looks at last season playoff teams.
| Team | Points on Dec 1/10 |
Final Standing |
Playoff Probability |
Lowest % after Dec 1. |
| Vancouver | 29 | 117 | 80% | 80% |
| Washington | 38 | 107 | 99% | 82% |
| Philadelphia | 34 | 106 | 98% | 98% |
| Pittsburgh | 34 | 106 | 97% | 97% |
| SAN JOSE | 26 | 105 | 53% | 27% |
| Detroit | 34 | 104 | 98% | 96% |
| Boston | 28 | 103 | 95% | 95% |
| Tampa Bay | 31 | 103 | 75% | 59% |
| ANAHEIM | 29 | 99 | 29% | 13% |
| NASHVILLE | 27 | 99 | 38% | 32% |
| PHOENIX | 29 | 99 | 65% | 40% |
| LOS ANGELES |
26 | 98 | 60% | 45% |
| CHICAGO | 30 | 97 | 57% | 39% |
| Montreal | 32 | 96 | 94% | 62% |
| BUFFALO | 29 | 93 | 70% | 68% |
| NY Rangers | 29 | 93 | 70% | 68% |
Seven of sixteen 2011 playoff teams dropped below the Habs current probability level after December 1st. Almost half the playoff field was viewed as less than a 50% probability to qualify.
The Canadiens were at 94% last season at this point, did that stop the negativity and expectation that they would somehow miss the playoffs in March or April last year?
Nope.
Why not look for indicators in which the process might lead to future success?
If you are a regular at EOTP you will be familiar with Fenwick%, PDO etc. and our positive outlook on the Canadiens as we attempt to measure process instead of result.
Using scripts provided by sites like timeonice and behindthenet it is easy to find even strength possession numbers and assess how important they are to future performance. (The scripts only cover the last 4 seasons, so these results are based on years 2008-2011.)
For the better part of a decade the Canadiens have been an extremely poor possesion team, even during the 2008 season when they won the East their possession numbers were mediocre (.471%).
Their poor play 5 on 5 was offset by an elite powerplay unit. Even though the majority of fans would love to see Jacques Martin fired he has managed to take the this team and transform it into a team that has the puck more than it's opponents, takes more shots and creates more scoring chances. Even when the Canadiens were struggling early in the season the process was sound and the results were skewed.
Below are the average fenwick rates of the past four Cup champions, the last 64 playoff teams, 56 non-playoff teams and the bottom feeders of the NHL. (Fenwick rates are measured in close games to minimize score affect).
The Canadiens have had a playoff worthy Fenwick rate all season and for long stretches it qualified among the elite. All of this has been accomplished with four defensemen who hadn't played more than 2 NHL regular season games before October 2010.
So the question becomes how relevant is Fenwick to playoff success?
72% of playoff teams over the last four seasons have had a +.500 Fenwick %. 8 teams with a sub .500 % have managed to win a playoff round and all of them possessed strong to elite special teams to offset mediocre fenwick numbers. Only one team managed to win the Stanley Cup and the 2009 Penguins percentage was .499. If you isolate the Penguins number with the return of Sergei Gonchar and the hiring hiring of Dan Bylsma the number improves to .549, similar to the average rate of the past four champions.
If you search for negativity, confirmation bias will lead the way. The Canadiens trail the Leafs by 3 points and the media would have you believe that this season is a disaster. Down the 401 the media is printing playoff tickets and could care less that the Leafs are a prime candidate for regression.
There are enough real problems to be concerned with (ie. Markov's health, poor luck or lack of finish), so why try to manufacture panic?
Avoid the mob mentality. The media is setting fire to cars and looting the city, joining in will not make things better it will create a bigger mob and more damage. Barring more injuries, this team will make the playoffs.
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by Kevin van Steendelaar on Dec 4, 2011 11:40 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Damned button got stuck on my BB!
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by Kevin van Steendelaar on Dec 4, 2011 11:48 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Just to play devil’s advocate (and I say this as a full supporter of Jacques Martin, and as someone who believes that our results will turn around soon)… when you say that “even during the 2008 season when they won the East, their possession numbers were mediocre” – is that perhaps an indication that the Fenwick rate is not a great indicator of our success? I mean, I understand your focus on “process” and the idea that if you have the right process, then eventually the results will come. But if we got good results over an entire season without great success in the “process” indicators, then perhaps those indicators aren’t the most useful measurements?
I also understand that, if you look at the league overall, the Fenwick rate seems to be somewhat correlated to making the playoffs. But I think you could argue that perhaps Montreal has below-average success in converting shots into goals, and that the Fenwick rate perhaps isn’t the “holy grail” of indicators of our success. If you look at our 2010 playoff run (admitting that it too was a small sample size), we were consistently outshot and blocked a ton of shots, but often won those games when we likely had a bad Fenwick percentage.
Really just playing devil’s advocate. I enjoyed the post and do believe (and hope!) that the results will come soon enough, but I’m also a little skeptical of completely seeking refuge in “process” indicators.
Look at the underlying numbers from the 1st place finish and you’ll see that it was the result of awesome special teams play (plus good penalty differential) and strong goaltending. All things fenwick doesn’t claim to measure.
That year if anything shows how you have to be great at everything else to make up for poor even strength play by your skaters. Also the number of penalties handed out by referees has decline precipitously since that year, so such a strategy is far less viable now then it was then.
by Stephan Cooper on Dec 4, 2011 2:26 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Further on this, Montreal was +40 that season (really +41 discarding shootout) of that +30 was from 5 on 4 special teams play. They also probably wouldn’t have been positive on 5 on 5 without a stellar goaltending combination. Price was .920 sv%, Huet .916 and Halak .934 that year.
by Stephan Cooper on Dec 4, 2011 3:03 AM EST up reply actions
This is a great point and one I wish I had noticed earlier.
I was wondering why more and more strong fenwick teams were making the playoffs with each passing year and your powerplay observation is exactly why.
In 2008 the league handed out 17,107 minutes in penalties which resulted in 1871 powerplay goals. In 2011 that number dropped to 14,339 minutes and 1571 powerplay goals.
The emphasis has been placed back on 5 vs 5 play making fenwick% an even great factor in determining a teams success.
Here are the year to year stats in regards to PP time and goals and the teams with sub .500 fenwick teams who made the playoffs.
2008 – 17,107 minutes/1871 PP goals/7 teams
2009 – 16.487 minutes/1938 PP goals/5 teams
2010 – 14,854 minutes/1664 PP goals/4 teams
2011 – 14,339 minutes/1571 PP goals/2 teams
2012 – 15,090 minutes/1583 PP goals/?? teams
There has been a drastic reduction in PP time between 2008 when 7 teams made the playoffs with poor possesion rates and 2011 when only 2 teams managed it. This season is looking to finish similar to 2011 making 5 on 5 production very important.
by Chris Boyle on Dec 4, 2011 11:34 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
This is an incredibly important point that many people fail to recognize.
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by Andrew Berkshire on Dec 4, 2011 11:53 AM EST up reply actions
To me, this bit of info is as much a story as the Fenwick success relation.
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Yeah, I was steadily researching fenwick and wondered about the “fluke 2008” season when 7 teams made it. I really had no intention of crafting an article around it last night, but this just came together organically and I included it.
When Stephan brought it up it made sense and I wish I had crafted it into the piece last night, it would have had more of an impact.
Yeah, this is something I researched (although I intuitively knew it was something of a factor) when people brought up 07-08 in comparing Carboneau and Martin.
The strategy that lead to the 1st place finish is obsolete. They had to adapt to being a better 5 on 5 team or the team would be sunk.
by Stephan Cooper on Dec 4, 2011 12:32 PM EST up reply actions
I also wonder if maybe it was a deliberate moneypuck strategy by Gainey to build a team that way. For a team without any elite forward talent it was probably much easier to build a competitive team in that high powerplay enviroment, based around special teams play and goaltending which may have been easier to find then a good bunch of 5 on 5 players.
by Stephan Cooper on Dec 4, 2011 12:54 PM EST up reply actions
It is amazing how teams coming out of the lockout with the proper powerplay elements were instantly rewarded with very little GM insight or planning.
Look how ridiculous 17,000 minutes looks in regards to todays rate.
In 2006 there were 23,679 penalty minutes and 2545 goals scored. A guy like Gomez falls into 90 points and undeserved millions and spends the next 5 years fighting off a false perception of his production.
The Leafs almost snuck into the 2006 playoffs on the basis of 107 PP goals. They only had 254 in total.
If penalties were called with that same frequency, you have to think last year’s SCF final result is reversed.
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by Andrew Berkshire on Dec 4, 2011 2:13 PM EST up reply actions
Thanks, this helps. Where I was going with my comments (and thanks to you and Stephan for doing the legwork on the stats) is that recent Habs teams seem to have been somewhat unique in relying on stellar goaltending and elite powerplays to enjoy success, and that relying on the Fenwick rate as the primary indicator of whether we enjoy success may not be representative of this team’s results. It certainly makes sense that, as powerplay time is diminishing, Fenwick is becoming a more reliable indicator of wins. However, I’m still concerned that for whatever reason, we are still in the bottom third of the league in shooting percentage (http://www.quanthockey.com/TS/TS_ShotPercentage.php).
Logically, that is the link between Fenwick rate and success, so I’m just saying that we shouldn’t put all our faith that a good Fenwick rate will necessarily lead us to the playoffs.
I am not indicating that the Habs will make the playoffs because of strong fenwick alone. They have an elite goaltender and if Markov returns will likely see a large bump in their powerplay.
I just can’t stand the negativity and the manipulation of the masses who are nothing more than parrots to what they read in the MSM. This team is good, luck and injuries may conspire to keep them out of the playoffs, but I am not subscribing to it being a longshot because they have to play .625 hockey when all the other mediocre teams have to hit that mark as well.
It is likely that a playoff spot won’t require 96 points.
Thanks for the analysis Chris. Now here is the antithesis… I’m going to talk about my feelings.
I remember the 2008 season quite well (who doesn’t if you’re a Habs fan I suppose) and the feeling that it wasn’t quite real – we were sort of a bubble waiting to burst. I had the same feeling in the 2009 season and play-off run.
The team started to feel different to me last year and feels very different this year. The team feels more solid and sure of themselves. There are periodic periods of wild panic when these raw rookie defensemen get running around a bit, and we have not shown up for a few games (3 by my account – what team doesn’t have a few of those) but there are long periods of control with crisp, short passing and very fast attack. Yesterday’s second and third period are a great example. Even down a goal in the third, where you expect the Kings to have a lot of puck possession, we demonstrated great control.
To me, the stats Chris provides support what I am seeing (and feeling) on the ice. This feels like the best team we have had in 10 years. Now we just need the results to back it up.
by VVV on Dec 4, 2011 7:26 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Holy Cats !
That’s a lot of statistics ! If they were a reliable predictor of outcome owners could play Strat-O-Matic hockey every year to decide the Cup.
I am outside Montreal myself, wayyyyyyyyy outside in Lexington Kentucky. I only know what I read, see on NHL network & hear from the savants on this blog. I don’t think the Habs are any different then any other storied professional franchise (Yankees, Giants, Knicks, Celtics, ETAL). Their fan-base is rabid, & their management exploits this all the way to the bank. As long as the seats at the Bell Centre are full at top-dollar, Montreal will feel no sense of urgency to improve the product (see Toronto). Gauthier will say a few pithy things to the press, Pod-person/Android Jacques Martin will promise better times, things will continue on as before & all of a sudden the players are on the golf course & the fans are saying “What the hell just happened?”
This team needs a shake-up & it needs it damn quick.
There are no points for style, only for wins & there are too few this season.
Fire Martin, bring in Lemaire, before it is too late.
Nothing Is Fool proof if you have the right fools.
Jacques Lemaire has a .563 career winning percentage.
Jacques Martin has a .551 career winning percentage.
Two extra points over 82 games. 1 point over 55 games.
Hey, anything to improve the team!
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Jacques Lemaire also had some rather talented New Jersey teams, and one of the top 5 all-time goaltenders, to work with.
Martin coached Ottawa and Florida teams with nowhere near the talent levels and two seasons in Montreal with a slew of injuries to key players.
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by Kevin van Steendelaar on Dec 4, 2011 11:53 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Well, I think the Minnesota expansion years for Lemaire were worse than any team Martin had, though, including Florida.
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and one of the top 5 all-time goaltenders, to work with.
I wouldn’t go that far… deeper analysis shows Brodeur being, at best, simply a “good” goaltender, not much else.
by Hunter Durfee on Dec 4, 2011 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
Well everyone within the advance stat community agrees that non-repeating performance (what might be called luck) is a huge factor. So predicting who will be a good/bad team isn’t that hard, picking winners is all but impossible.
by Stephan Cooper on Dec 4, 2011 12:48 PM EST up reply actions
Great piece Chris.
I’m still in the Jr. Kindergarten level when it comes to totally analysing PDO/Fenwick, but I’m going to run a little experiment over the next month or so of the season using it.
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by Kevin van Steendelaar on Dec 4, 2011 11:59 AM EST via mobile reply actions
So Leblanc gets a well deserved longer look and Palushaj gets sent down. Solid decision by the org.
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by Andrew Berkshire on Dec 4, 2011 12:03 PM EST reply actions
I think Palushaj’s time in the organization is drawing to a close, at the NHL level. Gomez must be close to a return as well then.
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by Kevin van Steendelaar on Dec 4, 2011 1:18 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t think that’s even close to true. He’s still the top guy in Hamilton and is on a similar learning curve to Pacioretty. His overall play in the NHL has actually been very good, he’s just not ready yet. Being outpaced by a superior player like Leblanc is nothing to be ashamed of. I would be very surprised if Palushaj doesn’t challenge for a roster spot next year, or even by March of this year if the injuries keep on.
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by Andrew Berkshire on Dec 4, 2011 2:12 PM EST up reply actions
If you search for negativity, confirmation bias will lead the way.
or if you search for positivity, or if you search for moderation, or if you search for kittens for that matter. confirmation bias is a tricksy bitch.
Oh and by the way
A Happy 102nd Birthday to hockey’s greatest franchise.
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by Kevin van Steendelaar on Dec 4, 2011 1:27 PM EST reply actions
This is an interesting piece by our friends at Matchsticks and Gasoline.
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by Kevin van Steendelaar on Dec 4, 2011 1:30 PM EST reply actions
heh yeah, I live in Calgary now and was thinking about this last night when I heard Jay Feaster’s comments on the radio. I definitely think management for most sports teams (not just hockey) have been slow to realize that many, perhaps the majority of fans of their teams now rely on well-written blogs for their information, over newspaper articles and TV reports that are becoming shorter and shorter by the day.
On the other hand, I know that Jay Feaster has had to deal with questions around Jarome Iginla rumours for days now, and I can understand his frustration. Still, he shouldn’t have trivialized the entire blogosphere as he did, it’s just not a good marketing strategy for your main consumers and ticket buyers.
Excellent read
Good stuff here Chris. This whole stats thing is more fascinating with every article you guys post.
Great article Chris. Two back- to- back losses to the Bruins have seemed to put a road block on plans for a parade in Toronto. The fact is after jumping out to a 7-3-1 record they have struggled to playing .500 hockey. Yet the media whether it is TSN, HNIC, Toronto Star, Team 590 etc., have only talked about the resurgent Leafs.
On the other hand the Canadiens have had a record of 10-6-3 after starting the season 1-5-2. Currently only 3 points separate both teams yet you would not know that if you followed the media.
Also the so-called Canadian media coverage (TSN, HNIC) failed to mention the success of the Senators who are only 3 points behind the Leafs and there is a team in Vancouver who has come on lately with a 15-10-1 record which is the best of all Canadian teams.
There is a reason why the Canadiens have made the play-offs the past few seasons while the Leafs have failed to do so. Perhaps because the Canadiens hear and read how bad they are playing and need to improve, they also act on it.
If one hears Team 990 on the radio, it seems everything about the Habs is a disaster this year. On Team 590 they are talking about how amazing the Leafs are this year.
The Leafs read and hear how much potential they have every October and their struggles are sugar coated by the media. Last season the Leafs heard how good they were after January and failed to realize it takes a full 82 game effort to make the play-offs. The Leafs are used to hearing how good they are, they probably don’t put in the extra effort to work harder.
Thank God for Blogs like ‘Eyes on the Prize’ where balanced coverage gives us a good feel for the Canadiens.
As everyone said, GREAT read. (you said they will make the playoff so…)
Fun to see good fenwick teams being more in playoff spot since 2008. It will be fun to see if 14 or more will be in this years and after. Maybe luck will be losing in influence.
Over 82 games, not a lot of the teams that made it with below 500 Fenwick marks were really luck-based, it was more special teams based, as well as goaltending. Chris and Stephan pointed this out higher up in the comments, as PP time has dropped significantly in the NHL every year since 2008. That just puts the emphasis on even strength play, and strengthens the importance of the Fenwick number.
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We know that Jacques Martin’s plan is customized to have goaltending and special teams manufacture points in the standings.
The Habs have one third of that plan executed to perfection; their penalty kill is tied for 2nd in the league, at 89.1% efficiency.
This is exactly what this article is about. Engels has totally missed the point. The Habs USED TO rely on goaltending and special teams, but they have changed over the last three years into a strong possession team. It is like listening to a whole media base that isn’t paying attention to what is going on.
Well, to be fair, he’s not really getting it from the media… “goaltending and special teams” is a common mantra of JM, or at least it was in his first year.
And from a coaching standpoint he’s not wrong; these percentage aspects have a huge impact at the individual game level. It’s pretty obvious to me, though that JM understands the importance of 5-on-5 play and works hard at it.
And it’s not like you can’t be a strong possession team with good goaltending and special teams. That wouldn’t suck. :D
Maybe it's just me
But whenever Martin says goaltending and special teams are the key to success, I kind of think he’s just crediting the work of his coaching staff. We know he doesn’t run the special teams, his assistant coaches do. And we know he’s not the goalie coach.
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by Andrew Berkshire on Dec 5, 2011 1:18 PM EST up reply actions
The point was repeating what a coach tells you is not insightful. What team doesn’t rely on goaltending and special teams? They are easy focal points.
He is missing the story of the season so far and is getting into revisionist history about “slighting” Gorges and rewarding Markov.
If Gauthier locks up Gorges for 5 years @ 4M per we get “overpaid”!!
If somebody has access to a piece in which Engels complained about Gorges not getting a big deal and Markov getting a one year deal in the summer, then I will gladly tip my hat to him.
There were quite a few people who complained about that, but even if they did it doesn’t make them right. Bottom line as far as Markov and Gorges go, one was a UFA and the other a RFA. Markov could have entertained other teams if they didn’t meet his demands, so he got term. And with the way this season has gone, I think most intelligent people would agree that 3 years for Markov would be better than one.
But yes, using a cliched soundbyte instead of actually analyzing the coaching style is about as lazy as it gets.
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by Andrew Berkshire on Dec 5, 2011 3:16 PM EST up reply actions
Besides, Carey Price had a .929 SV% in November, did he not? So I’d say we’re 2/3 of the way there based on this evaluation. Just based on counting stats, .919 for the year and a 2.23 GAA is still considered getting good goaltending, correct?
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Last I checked .920 was considered elite, so yup!
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by Andrew Berkshire on Dec 5, 2011 3:17 PM EST up reply actions
That makes for a lot of elite goaltenders.
One of the other effects of the drop in penalties is that the overall percentages tilt more to the goaltenders’ side if only because they face more 5-on-5 and fewer 4-on-5 shots.
Pre-lockout the league average SV% was .910.
With all the PP’s after the lockout the average SV% plummeted to .901, the worst rate since 1996. Since that lockout it is steadily increasing.
2006 – .901
2007 – .905
2008 – .909
2009 – .908
2010 – .911
2011 – .912
2012 – .913
.920 is still above the league average, but not as much as it would seem.
9 starters last year were above .920 so maybe elite isn’t the right word. However consistently posting that mark would put you in the top 3-5 goalies in the league over a few years.
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by Andrew Berkshire on Dec 5, 2011 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
His was also a pretty small sample size.
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by Andrew Berkshire on Dec 5, 2011 5:10 PM EST up reply actions
.920 is about as good as anyone can be over a long period of time. I think its for similar reasons that there are very few players that can consistantly score more than 30 goals a year although every year there are quite a few players that do.
by Stephan Cooper on Dec 5, 2011 5:27 PM EST up reply actions

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